Apr 072012
Actually, the word baghaya means and is most widely taken as:
Beautiful couplets from Poetry:
In another book, Mirza writes the following poetry. He is addressing one of his opponents, Molvi Abdul Haq Ghaznavi, has reminded Mirza of his failure in the prophecy of Atham:
“And in the case of Atham you are mentioning the curse of people
Make sure people have always cursed the pious ones
And people are blind that they start abusing quickly
thus their curse O Ibne Ahmaq (Son of Stupid) is nothing
O the one who is afflicted with cursed, leave the mentioning of curse
did you not see that after BAKWAAS (useless talk) what has happened to you
You cursed me and God curse you on your face
and curse is God’s curse
And I do not see in you knowledge and intelligence
and you attack like a pig and make noise like a donkey
Raqasta ka raqsa Bagheeyatin fil majaalis – And you danced like a prostitute dances in a gathering
and declared me Faasiq although you are the most faasiq”
(Roohani Khazain vol.12 p.234-235)
“And in the case of Atham you are mentioning the curse of people
Make sure people have always cursed the pious ones
And people are blind that they start abusing quickly
thus their curse O Ibne Ahmaq (Son of Stupid) is nothing
O the one who is afflicted with cursed, leave the mentioning of curse
did you not see that after BAKWAAS (useless talk) what has happened to you
You cursed me and God curse you on your face
and curse is God’s curse
And I do not see in you knowledge and intelligence
and you attack like a pig and make noise like a donkey
Raqasta ka raqsa Bagheeyatin fil majaalis – And you danced like a prostitute dances in a gathering
and declared me Faasiq although you are the most faasiq”
(Roohani Khazain vol.12 p.234-235)
48 Responses to “Mirza Ghulam Ahmed and Baghaya”
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Wow amazing. can you please give the reference of index where MGAQ himself defined baghaya? That’s really something to show our ahmadi brothers.
This should be in the Ahmadiyya starter kit. How can an Ahmadi read this and remain as an Ahmadi??
Thank you for educating the masses about the characterless Mirza. A lot of people do not know that. Your web site is doing a great job of educating the masses in a peaceful manner. We know we do not mean any harm to Ahmadis, however, it is important to realize that certain aspects of the beliefs and practices of Mirza need to be discussed to show Ahmadis that what you are following is in essence a cult based system which has nothing to do with Islam. Through education and dialogue we hope that we can persuade them to realize this.
Your index is made up. There is no such index in any book of Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as). I have searched it with my non-ahmadi friends and showed to them that there is no such index in any book of Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as). What a lie.
The first big lie is that Mirza GAQ claimed to be a Maseeh Maud. There is no such word in Quran or Hadith as far as I know of that says Maseeh Maud.
Second big lie is Mirza GAQ claimed to be Messiah. The holy Quran and Hadith refer to only one person as the Messiah and that is Jesus (Isa) Son of Mary peace be upon them.
There are numerous times where Mirza GAQ lied and tried to cheat gullible masses in the name of Islam, to serve his Masters.
Now Ahmadiyya is so embarassed with his false claims and foul language that they are starting to delete those references or try to mislead us by giving some lame excuses. For example, the tranlation of the word Baghaaya is being done in such a way that this total gives a different and false meaning, whereas Mirza GAQ used it to degrade people in the worst possible manner by calling them as children of prostitutes.
To those who know it is clear, Mirza GAQ was no messiah or a mahdi, but a grand liar who tried to steal the personality of Jesus p.bu.h. and falsely stated that he is burried in Kashmir in India, whereas that tomb belongs to Yuz Asap who is not Jesus as.
To those who do not know the liar Mirza GAQ what can we do just hope they realize their mistake, but since there is no compulsion in religion for truth stands clear from falsehood, to each is their own. Our job is just to convey the message. Guidance comes for GOD almighty only.
http://www.2shared.com/document/kaPgBuMg/rk-16-index.html
read the older version of the book and show it to your friends again if you are truthful.
@ Asif
You people keep changing books around. Thats the problem. You have even re-numbered the Quran so that un-educated Ahmadis will never find a reference that we present to them. Furthermore, are you challenging the reference? Do we need to pull the original book? Do you have a copy of that?
@ Ahmedi.org team
In the future we must reference from the original books. Runhai Khazain is always changing as is Tadhkirah.
Does anyone remember a few years ago when I found that the 2009 issue of Tadhkirah was missing ilham of MGA wherein he called Muslims as Kafirs???
@ Let it go: Firstly, problem is that you guys moderate all the comments and don’t process all the comments. For viewers of your website this should be good enough reason to believe that all you guys are saying is not correct. Secondly, it’s your lame understanding of prophethood due to which you say that Hazrat Maseeh maud (as) stole the personality of Jesus (as) or stole the prophethood of Prophet Muhammad (saw). Stealing prophethood is not a matter of joke. If someone would even think of doing that Allah has taken care of that and will take care of that. This is a clear proof that Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) had the support of Allah.
@ Yousaf Ahmad: How and why should anyone trust you that the file you have loaded is not made up? We have nothing to hide. In this modern day of technology, it’s not possible. Just look at you, you made up some stuff and now you are hiding behind this argument that Jama’at changes its books. If we had to hide things to save ourselves from animosity, we would have hidden a book “eik ghalti ka azala” where hazrat maseeh maud (as) himself said that he is a nabi. If we didn’t change that why we would have changed a simple translation of baghaya? As an ordinary ahmadi, i don’t care how you define it. But if you want to believe that Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) called you progeny of a prostitute then be it. I don’t care. But the truth is this that Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) came to guide all of you to the true teachings of Islam given by Prophet Muhammad (saw). He was a reformer and he had nothing to gain by abusing others.
@Rash:
I liked that you used the word uneducated for ahmadis. You forgot that our Prophet Muhammad (saw) was an ummi. Brother, to get guidance you don’t need to have so called educated people. No wonder you guys have lost direction because you have not understood even a word of Quran.
Now i dare you guys to post my comment, if you have nothing to hide.
Asif,
All I can say is that the brothers who have posted the information here true. They are not making any money out of it like the Ahmadiyya cult. It is for education. Prophets are appointed by GOD almighty and they are honest persons. Have you not read the teachings of MIRZA GAQ that are full of lies and false prophecies. You say he had the support of ALLAH, I say no he did not. He was not Maseeh Maud but may be Masseh Dajjal. This is another reason why he did not have the support of ALLAH s.w.t, and was never a practicing Muslim, also never performed HAJ, Look at his progeny also and what sort of character they held. It is all very clear to those who can see and reflect. Just like Mirza GAQ his cult is also slave of its masters and serving them well. To each its own. If you still want to be in this cult, good luck to you, but if you fear Aakhirah and want to know the truth, then here it is, Mirza GAQ was no Messiah or a Prophet, Ahmadiyyat is a separate religion unto itself. Surely, the true religion in the eyes of ALLAH s.w.t is ISLAM.
Dear Asif, I dont know why would you say such a lie that we don’t approve comments. I have never disapproved a comment unless it contains swearing. There are so many things I would like to say here.
1.– You say “If someone would even think of doing that Allah has taken care of that and will take care of that”. You see my problem is don’t accept anything believe anything unless you prove it to me. Now, can you please bestow us with your great knowledge Allah took care of which false claimants of prophet hood. I want the names of those people please, don’t run away with this now.Give me the names , details and everything.
2. “This is a clear proof that Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) had the support of Allah.”
–You see here again you just made a statement which you will now have to prove. How do you define support of Allah?
3. “How and why should anyone trust you that the file you have loaded is not made up?”
–LOL again, you can’t just say it’s made up, you have to prove it’s made up. Prove me wrong I swear I will turn to Ahmadiyyah. Save this screen shot and accept my challenge. Do your research, make an article and use all your library to prove me that I made up this book I will become the most humble Ahmadi.
4. “But if you want to believe that Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) called you progeny of a prostitute then be it. I don’t care.”
–Lol, look at your language OMG.
5. ” But the truth is this that Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) came to guide all of you to the true teachings of Islam given by Prophet Muhammad (saw). He was a reformer and he had nothing to gain by abusing others.”
– he had no other choice except to abuse others. Guidance is already here which is Quran. We don’t need a new claimant of prophethood to understand anything.
@ Asif
I know that Muhammad (saw) was unlettered. In that era, that was common. In today’s day and age…there are many people who arent educated on the collegiate level, this stops them from researching references and what not. This is what I am referring to…do you understand that? Ahmadiyyat preys on this shortcoming of the masses and subsequently changes books around so that references are impossible to find.
I remember..back when I was an Ahmadi…the #1 response from Ahmadis was that the references that Muslims presented simply didnt exist. THIS IS A BOLD FACE LIE. Later on…I learned the ins and outs of Ahmadi referencing.
Friends, when stumped for proof, Ahmedis often resort to “Well if Mirza Saheb was a false Nabi, Allah would have punished him and morever, his jamaat would not be flourishing.” They quote a verse in the Qur’an as proof. As far as I understood the verse is about a true Nabi who makes attributes to Allah what Allah has not revealed, would be punished. Baha died a natural death. There are many “Prophets” in Evangalical Christains who claim to be conversing with God/Holy Spirit and nothing happens to them or their followers. Not sure what Guru Nanak claimed, but he died a natural death too and his followers are flourishing. On another note, Shia Imams claim to be Masoon (and divinely guided); a lot of them die natural deaths including Khomeni.
@Mubashir: You are wrong. Bahaullah never claimed that he was a prophet. Just like Jesus never claimed he was a god. Bahaullah spent most of his time in prison and/or in hiding for fear of life. his followers later on made him prophet or god.
Probably you are taking about mormons, yes they have some so called prophets and one of them is in jail these days. Name me one of their prophets that has gained fame and opposition like Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as)?
As you said yourself, you don’t know what Guru nanak’s claim was, so you shouldn’t even be mentioning his name as you don’t know his claim. But for your information he never claimed to be god or a prophet. Infact sikhs believe in ‘wahay guru’ one god.
One of the bani of Guru Nanak ji is:
“Awwal Allah noor upaya qudrat keh sab banday
Ik noor se sab jag upja kon bhalay kon manday”
Regarding imams, they never claimed to be prophets. If they had claimed to be prophets, i don’t know how you can compare imam’s with prophets. If you think imams are prophets then why are you even arguing about ahmadis, you should go and start fighting with shias because as per your believes they have about 10 or 12 prophets, and they are also greater in number about 25% of muslims. Aren’t they a greater fitna for you then ahmadis?
I get astonished when people try to defend false prophets, by showing that how Allah did not kill them and they flourished. For God sakes have some ghairat for Allah ta’ala and His Deen. Allah can never let a false prophet say things claiming to be from Him.
and you got it all wrong that the verse was for a true prophet only. Do you think Hazrat Muhammad (saw) nauzobillah would have ever lied? But Allah ta’ala using him as an example said that any person if lied to be a prophet would have perished. Don’t you see that Noor is everywhere? Please open your eyes to see it.
Sohail, the very first image is the index which you are asking for.
sorry Yousaf, you know how ahmadis are. They keep on saying that everything is either made-up or lie. Please give me the page number or the name of the book from where i can find this text to show it to my friend.
janab hum to samajh rahay thay keh aap keh pass bara ilm hai, yeh pehla reference jo aap nain diya hai woh to kahin bhi rohani khazain keh search database main nahi mila. yeh kya chakar hai? apnay pass se hi banaay jaa rahay ho cheezain?
apka kasoor nahin hay, kitaabain badal di gai hain. purana version yeh raha:
http://www.2shared.com/document/kaPgBuMg/rk-16-index.html
yeh lain
by text i meant the definition of baghaya in the index you have shown in the article.
Sohail, on the ruhani khazain search engine and the download links the books have been edited. They have taken out the index from it and that’s because they can’t handle it.
http://www.2shared.com/document/kaPgBuMg/rk-16-index.html
I had the original book, download it, you’ll find it on page 17.
Thanks, spread the light. bless you
How poor and wrong of you guys! But nice trick
AHMADIYYAT ZINDABAD!
I know it’s very wrong to tell the truth right on face and others can’t even run.
http://www.2shared.com/document/kaPgBuMg/rk-16-index.html
@ True Muslim
Take some time to listen to what we are saying. Do you guys know that “Islami sul ki Filasafee” was translated by Muhammad Ali as “The Teachings of Islam”. Do you know that this was promoted in the ROR for over 7+ years. This is an example of Ahmadiyya deception.
In fact, “Philosophy of the Teachings of Islam” wasnt officially translated into english til the 1970′s.
In conclusion, there are many degrees of Ahmadiyya deception. I can write up an article on this if the readers are seriously interested.
The Rash
How sad that jamaat has to take out these pages from the ruhani khazain no wonder they are afraid. I’ll upload the real book which i downloaded 8 years ago from the same alislam.org.
This page and no sign of the index in the new version. I will prove it!
Ahmadi brothers, I was sorry to see that even the page doesn’t coincides with the recent version of ruhani khazain you totally overlooked when Mirza Sahib himself translates his arabic version into persian and translates “baghi” and “baghaya” as “zanan-e-fahisha”. Also, in the poetry he called his opponent as “bad-kaar aurat” you people over looked that as well. May Allah have mercy on you people and give all of us hidaaya to understand facts but not overlook them.
http://www.2shared.com/document/kaPgBuMg/rk-16-index.html
Here’s the link of the real Ruhani Khazain which By the grace of Allah has always been in my computer. After which you will realize why jama’at would take this index out.
After uploading this I feel sorry for the innocent people who don’t know what’s going on. My request is you to think.
@ Yousaf
I wrote this a few years ago….enjoy:
http://thecult.info/blog/2010/02/24/new-tadhkirah-vs-the-old-they-play-games-with-books/
http://www.alislam.org/library/browse/volume/Ruhani_Khazain_Computerised/pages/Ruhani_Khazain_Computerised/16/Ruhani-Khazain-Vol-16_Page_458.png
This is the link from alislam . org, page 438 and Mirza translated baghaya as ” zanan fahisha” or slut in todays language.
This older index is compiled by Molana Jalaluddin Shams sahib, and not a writing of Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) so if it is removed from the newer computerized version then it’s not a problem. Jama’at does not need to hide the writings of Hazrat Maseeh maud (as). The older version is still available on http://www.alislam.org/urdu/rkold/rk-16-index.pdf, but even in the older version definition of baghi of a prostitute is correct based upon context. One should go back 2 pages before the index and read page 9 to 10 of the explaination given by Molana Jalaluddin Shams sahib himself stating that Hazrat maseeh maud (as) said that “we seek refuge from Allah that we may disrespect modest and pious people either they are muslim/christian or aryas, we only talk about those characterless people who have gone to no limits and are famous for abusive and trash talk”.
If one really wants to find the definition of baghi made by Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) himself, then he should read the definition in the book “Islami asool ki philosophy” in Ruhani Khazain volume 10 page 354.
@ Danish
Our point is that your jamaat is in the habit of adding and removing certain writings without explanation. A major piece of evidence is the Tadhkirah of 2009 vs. that of 2004. An entire ilham was deleted without explanation.
Another piece of evidence is Seeratul Mahdi (1st edition). This book has totally dissapeared.
Here’s one more: The Lahoris refer to an event from 1907 wherein Mahmud Ahmad was accused of illicit sexual behavior (see Faruqi, Truth Triumphs). However, this entire event is missing from the books and periodicals of Ahmadiyyat.
Can you guys respond to any of this??
@ Rationalist: I tried to send a comment yesterday, but i guess it went missing. In any case, i would suggest you to come to Holy Quran, which hasn’t been changed and which alone is the guidance. Let’s try to discuss on that rather than talking about which books went have changed and what ilhams are missing and what are not. It’s just a wasting of everyones time.
Trying to find examples from Lahoris is just like trying to find allegations against ummul momineen (ra) from the Shia’s. From your comment i got an idea that you have a bias for Jama’at and its personalities and you just want to defame and talk vulgar about them. This way you won’t be able to attract any ahmadi. Trust me. We know the amount of work Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) and his successors have done in the service to Islam, and such tactics won’t help your cause.
You might want to write those comments again because I haven’t got any to approve. BTW you can come to the forum with your friends and have an open discussion there.
@ Danish
Yes..the Quran hasnt been changed. However, your people are putting twists and turns on it regularly.
Furthermore, I am pointing out the fact that it was Ahmadis (lahoris) who accused Ahmadis of sex crimes and illicit behavior. They were the ones who took the lead in anti-Ahmadiyya polemics.
We are only supplementing their work.
Get the picture?
@Rationalist:
Shias are also muslims, yet they abuse ummul momineen, khulfa and other sahaba.. You got the picture?
@Yousuf: I am also glad that you appreciated another meaning of baghi. Yes Hazrat Maseeh Maud (as) has used word baghi for both the meanings in his various writings. But as Naveed Sb has explained to you that when he used this word as zuriyat ul bagha or ibn al bagha it becomes an idiom that means disobediet to a great level, and when he was talking about dancers or prostitutes he simply used the word baghaya which means as is.
If you won’t call prostitute a prostitute then would you call her a shareef zadi? That’s all my humble opinion on your forum on this subject of baghaya. Thanks.
@ Danish
Why are you bringing up the Shias? You didnt even make a point in your statement. Can you be clearer as to what you are referring to??
Ahmadis have been covering up the errors of Mirza for 100 years. Its very sad.
Danish,
I am glad that you have actually agreed that yes it does mean prostitute and whatever has been said has been said as it is. Baghi also means deprived of iman but it also means prostitute. Mirza Sahib has used it in both senses and this is good that you accepted it. No matter who he used it for do you think any prophet will use such language for his opponents.
In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful
The author of this blog has several inferences. There is one that Jama’at has moved/changed their literature. First of all, I will point out the original references which are still at alislam.org website and which have not been changed/removed.
About the reference of Baghaya, Street woman in the index of the pages; the original page is here: http://tinyurl.com/7djns6q. (Note that the new computerized addition does not have this reference in the new index). But whatever the reason may be, the original page to which this index refers to, is present in the computerised version: http://tinyurl.com/cmyard5 (line 9 of Arabic). The same page in the original publication can be found here: http://tinyurl.com/6u4ht4x.
Also, to prove his point the author has quoted references where the lonely word “Baghaya” has been mentioned on pages 429, 432 and 438 of volume 16. The lonely word “Baghaya” has been used exactly how it is supposed to be.
In reality the allegation is not about this lonely word in any particular case, the allegation is about the phrase, “Zurriyat ul Baghaya (???? ???????)” or “Ibn e Baghiya” (Volume 5, page 548: http://tinyurl.com/7nc4fef). The author alleges that Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (a.s.) has used this word for the entire Muslim Ummah.
To answer this allegation, I will take a very simple and straightforward approach.
For now, let us forget about how this phrase has been used by other scholars and how it has been referred to in the dictionaries. If a person is accused of something, a fair trial would establish the intent behind the actions of both the accused and the accuser. In this case, it is alleged that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s. has defamed the entire Ummah. To decide what he really meant and to put things into perspective one has to search his writings for another place where he might have used such a phrase and explained its’ meanings. This will explain to the reader in the very words of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s. what he means by this phrase. Categorically he has not only used the phrase but has also translated it himself.
“You have persecuted me out of your vileness and now if you do not die in disgrace, 0 wicked one (ibn bagha) I will not have been proved truthful in my claim,” ( http://tinyurl.com/7gwffra (footnote, page 450, volume 22), original print: http://tinyurl.com/6p94zcg).
All those who are in search of the truth, please see for yourself that the person who has been accused has himself proved his intention and has liberated himself from any blame. To attribute a different meaning to the similar phrase (Zuriyat (progeny) ul Baghaya) used at another location where translation has not been mentioned is not fair to the writer.
Basically, what I have proved here is that Promised Messiah a.s. has used harsh words in these cases with mild meanings which is in perfect alignment to the word Zaneem as pointed out in the end of this article as well. Zaneem literally means “bastard, baseborn or illegitimate” but in the context a mild meaning has been taken according to the intent of the Holy Qur’an.
This case yet again presents the resemblance that can be found and the Holy Qur’an and the writings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s. of Qadian.
In the end, I will share the reasons as to why Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s.felt a need to use such terminology in his writings. Basically, as the Holy Qur’an tells us, Wama untiqu anil hawa, in huwa illah whyun yuha, ‘the messenger doesn’t follow his own desires, whatever he tells you is revealed to him,’(http://tinyurl.com/buphhf7 Al Najm, verse 4,5). How could a subordinate Prophet of the Prophet Muhammad (Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon him), be different from Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) in this sense? Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s. also didn’t follow his own desires. On the other hand whatever he did, he did according to the revelations of Allah Ta’ala. He refuted his opponents with the same weapons he was attacked with in the first place.
Let it be very clear at this point that he did not do all this for self praise. His mission throughout his life remained the service of Islam and its propagation. He has said in his own words as to why he had to use such terminology:
“My words had assumed some severity against my opponents in my writings, but I was not the one to start such severity. Those writings were undertaken in reply to the severe attacks of my opponents. They had used such harsh and abusive language as called for some severity. This can be perceived by the comparison which I have instituted between the harsh language used by my opponents -and that used by me in the foreword of my book which I have called Kitabul Bariyyah. As I have just stated the harsh language used by me was by way of retort. It was my opponents who first used such language against me, I could have endured their harsh language without making a retort to it but I had recourse to a retort on account of two reasons: One, so that my opponents, being faced with severity in reply to their harsh strictures, might change their tactics and might revert in future to the use of civil language; and two, that the general Muslim public should not be aroused by the defamatory and provocative language used by my opponents.” (Kitabul Bariyyah, p. 11, line 6) http://tinyurl.com/6sqqut9
A collection of profanity that has been used against Islam, Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. and the Promised Messiah a.s. by the opponents: http://tinyurl.com/7b6kpps (volume 13, page 122, line 7).
An honest reader can witness in the link given above that the word “baghi” has been used by the accusers for this innocent messenger of Allah Ta’ala in their writings. The accusers themselves are guilty of profane language and baseless allegations. In reality the accusers themsleves are guilty of the very crime they allege towards Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s.
Molvi Abdul Haq Ghaznavi has himself used the word “baghi” which means “harot”, (a woman prostitute), http://www.thefreedictionary.com/harlot . His list of artwork with many other professionals of his calibre are referred here: http://tinyurl.com/845c22p (volume 13, page 150, line 10).
Through these rivalries that Muslims fostered among themselves, these Maulvis kept on helping Christians and Hindus by providing them with ample opportunities to raise fingers against Islam. And so there was a need to stop these Maulvis from internal rivalries, and to use their own language against them.
This is the reason why the word ‘bhaghi’ has been used by Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a.s. of Qadian against Molvi Abdul Haq Ghaznavi on page 235 of volume 12.
Also, if you see the context of the use of the alleged expression, which is:
“??? ???? ??????? ????? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ??? ?? ??????” that means, “…towards the wicked ones of whom Allah has sealed their hearts and they will not be accepted” this is in perfect alignment with the verse of the Holy Qur’an which says in chapter 47, verse 17:
“ ??????????? ????????? ?????? ???????? ?????? ??????????? ???????????? ?????????????” which means “…These are they whose hearts Allah has sealed, and who follow their own evil inclinations.” http://tinyurl.com/7jlm7jr
May peace and blessings of Allah be upon the one who follows the guidance! Ameen.
You have got to be kidding. Are you saying the vulgar language of Mirza GAQ is the same as holy Quran (Nauzubillah)? I dont think so. Even a grade 5 student will say that the writings of Mirza GAQ especially where he abused Isa. a.s is the language of a Masseh e Dajjal. Still if you cant understand this then call your relgion whatever you like but you cannot force anyone to accept your foolish point of view that Ahmadiyyat is somehow Islam. Leave Islam alone do whatever you like. To you is your religion and to us is ours.
@ Let it go
I have uncovered new research from Van Der Linden wherein he writes that MGA plagurized Lekh Ram’s curses towards the narrative of Jesus Christ (as) in the bible. MGA appears to have stole the arguments from the Arya Samaj as he went on his tirade against Christianity.
The writer of this reply doesn’t seem to realize the point. Can you tell me where in the article that I have produced the writer which is me has said that Mirza Sahib has used it for entire ummah? My point is, is this the kind of languages prophets use? Writing thousand times la’anat? Calling Masih of Bible with worst names? Gunning down opponents with Baghaya? saying haram zaada and words like that with versatility.
I guess so using harsh words is OK right, so I guess it’ll be ok if we would start calling you people harshly with this name? If a prophet says it’s Ok right, but if I call you ibn-baghi or bad-kar women you will accuse me that aww muslims this and that.
Good thing is you agreed that it means Prostitute, decision lies on the reader. I have done my job.
??????? (Excuse me, what Sir/Madam is your name):quotes Mirza Saheb :
As I have just stated the harsh language used by me was by way of retort. It was my opponents who first used such language against me, I could have endured their harsh language without making a retort to it but I had recourse to a retort on account of two reasons: One, so that my opponents, being faced with severity in reply to their harsh strictures, might change their tactics and might revert in future to the use of civil language; and two, that the general Muslim public should not be aroused by the defamatory and provocative language used by my opponents.” (Kitabul Bariyyah, p. 11, line 6) http://tinyurl.com/6sqqut9
Notice friends, Mirza Saheb does not say here that whatever he says is from Allah and therefore accept it!!
?????? Was asking us to accept Mirza Saheb’s language as whatever he said, was from Allah. Sorry, nice try, did not fly!!
System does not support unicode, my reply can be found here: https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1crYIOb22SvJyAAMU42dbkz-6IITAHzenjYaXnvmN7-0
-Naveed
Mirza GAQ was a liar, cheat and a fraud. There is no way he could be Messiah. Messiah is only one person Isa (Jesus) Son of Mariam a.s. He falsely used his poor knowledge of Islam and deceived his followers into a quagmire, from where they cannot think outside of the box. Now his followers are mentally confused and keep writing foolish arguments to try to dispute the authentic teachings of Islam, to suite Mirza GAQ lies. What a tragedy for the Ahamdis. Only if they can open their eyes.
@ truth
You nailed it bro. Ahmadis have been covering up the errors of their master for 100 years.
In fact, the entire concept of Ruhani Khuzain was an attempt by Ahmadi leaders at mixing up references. With the creation of RK, Ahmadis cant find the references that Muslims referred to 50+ years.
Thanks Bro. Good job!
Isn’t it a shame that the Ahmadiyya cult has been reduced to one lie after another. They now seem to be spending more time trying to defend lies of their cult than solving real problems, this is just one such example.
Gentlemen, I am not a big believer of any hadees reports/predictions that do not match the Qur’an. There is no prediction of Mirza Saheb’s prophethood in the Qura’n, neither a Mehdi or a Messiah to come. According to many scholars of the Qur’an, Jesus died and is not coming back. I have a feeling that if we take hadees books out of the picutre, Ahmeddiyat could not survive! Can they prove validity of Ahmediyyat from Qur’an and Qura’n alone (no hadees books please)?
@Mubashir:
If you don’t bring ahadith into discussion, 99% of the muslims would have to believe that Jesus is not coming back because Quran doesn’t mention this. They keep on mentioning ahadith such as la nabiya baadi to prove their point about the khatam e nabuwat, if they don’t bring ahadith into discussion and simply from Quran they cannot show even one verse that shows that no prophet can come after Prophet Muhammad saw. They cannot even show one verse from the Holy Quran that says that Prophet Muhammad saw is the last prophet. Remember word used is khatam and not akhir. Like Allah is Awwal and Aakhir, so for last in arabic word aakhir is used and Quran does not have such a word.
On the other hand prophets have been coming from time to time, so if there was such a limitation on their coming then burden of proof is on you to prove by giving such a verses from the Holy Quran that shows no prophet is going to come after Prophet Muhammad saw.
Good Job ,,,,,Keep it up…Jazak Allah
You are doing a great job of educating the masses………. !!!
Have’nt seen any videos from A. K. Sheikh sahib lately, hope that he is doing well.continue good work………..mashallah, you web site opens a lot of eyes.